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Rules for Anchorites

Letters from Proxima Thule


Last week I visited a major surplus stuff store, where I saw a poorly made rust and brassish candle holder with roughly cut gears stuck on.

I'm pretty sure that's the death knell for my subgenre, there.

I don't think just because it's popular it's uncool. Dude, I retell fairy tales like A LOT. But since it's become popular without producing very much that is not simply an attempt to capitalize its own perceived popularity WE ARE IN A PARADOX STOP I WANT TO GET OFF.

When you say

SF itself is a bit low on adventure and high on rigorous science and srs bsns lately.

What SF works did you have in mind?

What I actually had in mind was Abigail Nussbaum's recent essay about it and a lot of TV shows. But also Peter Watts' work, Banks and even Stephenson these days, and the several recent essays by Stross and others encouraging total hewing to rigorous current understandings of science.

@ Right now, the phrases "it's steampunk week at x giant site/magazine/irl event!" or "I'm working on my steampunk novel" make me break out in brain hives. I can be almost certain nothing good will come of it.

I disagree with this sentence. It's not the steampunkish gadgets that make a good or bad writing, it's the storytelling skills of the writer, the story itself, the interesting characters that contribute to a good book. You cannot say it's going to be bad just because it's steampunk (or fantasy, or magic realism etc.).

Sure I can. I can say that there is a 90% chance that it will be bad because in almost every instance I've seen people not applying the same level of good storytelling and expectations they do to other genres. It is a trend I have noticed.

Note I say almost. There are exceptions. But I am gunshy these days because I've read more bad steampunk than I care to.

Your Name Here (Anonymous) Expand
Your Name Here (Anonymous) Expand
Steampunk is fantasy set in a fake Victorian setting instead of a fake medieval setting, and is roughly as accurate. If it sticks around, presumably it will become more historically accurate in the same way that medieval fantasy has (at least the good stuff). Right now we're in the horses-as-automobiles and endless stew stage.

There's an awful lot of substance that could be inserted under the brass and leather surface. Will it be? Who knows.

I think this is pretty durn insightful, and it definitely provides a vehicle for improvement. Maybe someone needs to write A Tough Guide To SteamPunkLand; or Airship Piloting for Dummies.

Good lord, thank you. I could talk about this on my own LJ, but nowhere close to as many people will see it... so now you have yawped into the great void and people will actually THINK about it now.

I like the *idea* of steampunk. I like the pretty and the costumes and the stuff just as much as the next person. But I barely read the "genre" because so much of it is "Let's stick a zeppelin and some goggles in here and call it a story." There is so much room to SAY SOMETHING with steampunk--about progress and industrialization, about social classes and imperialism, and on and on. But no one seems to do that. I've been working on a story that, I suppose, takes place in a steampunky world, but I'm trying hard to give it an egg, to make it more than bustles and velvet. That might end up being the death of it. I dunno.

Sorry, just repeating your rant, which I've ranted myself lately. So, really, thank you.

I like the *idea* of steampunk. I like the pretty and the costumes and the stuff just as much as the next person. But I barely read the "genre" because so much of it is "Let's stick a zeppelin and some goggles in here and call it a story."

Word. I own goggles and liked The Difference Engine (a candidate for the role of the steampunk Neuromancer), but I haven't really read any self-professed steampunk fiction since, well, since all my goth friends started wearing brown. Once upon a time, a novel about steampunk zombie pirates and ninja vampires fighting over the world's supply of bacon might have been just the thing, but now I see yet another one and sigh.

A separate rant, or at least eye-roll accompanied sigh, would involve the way in which "steampunk" now comprises everything between George III and art deco.

I am inclined to agree. Steampunk isn't a genre - it's an aesthetic. It is about the look and feel, far more than substance. Throw in some gears, some clockwork this or that, sky pirates, a corset here or there, and you're good to go. It's a fun fad. Now, I don't even know why, but the aesthetic appeals to me. The fiction, however, has not, in the slightest. It feels paper thin, and I'd love to read some things were these elements work together and make sense and contribute to the story and wonderful characters, but I'm not holding my breath.

This probably explains why I have not successfully made my own costume and have no desire to write a steampunk novel, though I do enjoy a bunch of what I've read. Boneshaker kicks serious ass.

There is definitely something to be said for the 24/7 Shouting Machine (aka the Internet) having made things a wee bit on the insane side. Frankly, I think we all need to back away from it more often and go have a nice lie down.

As for disliking it, DUDE. I can't stand the Walking Dead and everyone's raving about how awesome and good it is.

No, it's not. Stupid sherriff's deputy is stupid and does not do basic detective work or ask the right questions. I feel your pain. But I am happy for my friends for having found something they enjoy.

*shrug* It is what it is, I think. If not Steampunk, it would have been some other bandwagon. After all Harry Potter's all tapped out and so's Twilight.

I can't stand the Walking Dead and everyone's raving about how awesome and good it is.

No, it's not. Stupid sherriff's deputy is stupid and does not do basic detective work or ask the right questions.

In the graphic novel series, pretty much every decision dumb-ass makes gets one or more of his friends and allies killed, in spite of which people keep following him.

It's funny. I'm a history and archaeology student (or was), and I find most of the component parts of steampunk fascinating and right up my alley. The nineteenth century is endlessly interesting to me. Do 'steampunk' authors do anything interesting with this grab-bag of cool shit? Not a damned thing. I went through the sci-fi/fantasy section at Austin's Book People looking for ONE recent steampunk novel that would be even remotely interesting and left empty-handed.

Steampunk is currently to adult fantasy/sci-fi as BEAUTIFUL VAMPYRE/WARWULF/MUMMY* ROMANCE is to the YA section, I guess. I'm sure someone could do an amazing job of it, but I'm also not sure if they've been born yet.

*BRB, writing my mummy romance novel.

Write the mummy romance. It'd be a break from the vampires. >_> *thought Evie and Imhotep should have done some more snogging, kthx*

Do werewolves get to be romantic leads? Or have I just been reading all the wrong books?

The most recent vampire book I've enjoyed does involve older male vampire, younger female human... But he spends a fair amount of the book avoiding her, she has her own teenagerly problems, and at one point, he tells her off for being a selfish teenager. Then he shows her a bit around the local area to teach her some of the history. They do not get together. The Night Wanderer by Drew Hayden Taylor.

I have yet to read a vampire romance that pleases me enough to want to recommend it to other people. *shakes fist at the genre* Do better!

I really enjoyed this rant/analysis - it was funny and pointed, and the paragraph about steampunk zombies, in particular, made me laugh a lot. I look forward to someday reading what you have to say about "maker," because OMG I HATE THAT TERM (as it has become popularly used, anyway).

How has it become popularly used, out of curiosity? /ignorant

Thank you for this post. You are much more articulate than I am and now I have something to link to when I try to explain why I don't really think of steampunk as a genre because there is no content. It's like steampunk is an aesthetic or fashion and it looks cool...and that's about it. I feel the same way about the popularity of cupcakes. A cupcake shop opened up down the street from me. It is way cool and hip inside and the products are beautiful and cool and tempting...so very, very pretty, but, uh, the taste is not as good or as special looking as the actual treat...and isn't the point of dessert to be as delicious as it looks? I dunno, that is how I think about steampunk, like over-priced, super cool cupcakes with names like pink champaigne that actually are just super sugary without the benefit of at least being something like vanilla or chocolate (which could give the treat a base to go from) and don't taste like anything all that special, or even close, to what their name evokes.

GAH! This this this.

I worked around the corner from a Sprinkles, there was always a line, I finally got one of my own and...

DUDE. My sister makes cupcakes and cake that taste ten thousand times better. I want the content to be as awesome as the look. And yes. Right now, Steampunk (AND Zombies) just don't have the content.

Your Name Here (Anonymous) Expand
I'll have to politely disagree on the Maker thing; anyone learning to make things done even in such a shallow context makes the idealistic life-hacker in me who wishes she could make EVERYTHING she needs, a bit warmer in the world of Apple and the like, where so many people cheerfully pay to use a thing they're patently not allowed to tinker with beyond a point, freedom within walls and all that.

But this?: A world where fashion covers up all sins, where you don't have to look at brown people if you have enough money to avoid them, and authenticity is defined as looking and acting just exactly like all your friends.

Preach on, lady. Aesthetic /= genre. I tried writing a steampunk story for a contest; the prizes were shinies, and I haven't been able to afford something pretty in some time, but I've been trying to suss out why it made me feel dirty without just being catty about personal experiences with the 'scene'. And I think this post sums it up nicely.

Oh, makers themselves I love. It's the term I hate. And not even the term, the way it's used to create a weird kind of elitist geek aristocracy.

I was having a conversation with someone about Diamond Age and The Difference Engine (plus Perdido Street Station to some extent), and how I felt like what is out now *isn't* the steampunk movement we'd been promised by those works. I remember being so delighted with Chris Bachalo and Joe Kelly's "Steampunk" comic because there was this class struggle storyline and machine control plot there, and there were characters of color (though not so well written) and I could see the potential in this amazing thing...

And now we have what we have. Which is, I suppose, just part of what happens in genres, and I'm glad there's something geeky making money, but I will neither be contributing to nor consuming from that particular base.

So your post comes as a relief. I, selfishly, don't want you to write this subgenre! ;)

I actually hate The Difference Engine, too. Sigh.

But I actually wonder how much money is really being made. Boneshaker is the only recent novel that has really hit--are there big bucks being made here? I'm not sure.

Your Name Here (Anonymous) Expand
I love your title :)

Well, you're making me feel hopeful. Because..without giving too much away...I am working on a story that is vaguely steampunkish, but not only is it not Shiny Shiny Wasn't the Gilded Age Awesome, it's downright vicious. I was afraid everyone would go, "awww, that's not what we like that stuff for." Now I know at least one person won't. I hope it will amuse.

Yes, thank you. I was sick of it quite awhile back. With, of course, the usual number of exceptions, it just seems so... empty. A bunch of pretty (but, as you point out, increasingly similar) costumes and not much behind that. I too think it has potential, but so far that hasn't been borne out.

Brava! This whole movement is starting to remind me of postmodern architecture - all decorated sheds and hamburger stands shaped like hamburgers. Incidentally, the only book I've ever read with both steam power and zombies in was a) emphatically not steampunk and b) very good indeed. I plan on avoiding nearly anything with zombies in like plague rats, though.

I have started to comment "steamjunk" when I see items that would be great accessories.

I had trouble with science fiction and fantasy (despite being raised on LOTR and William Gibson) when I was a kid, for many years. Then I finally figured out that it wasn't the genres that were my problem, it was the fact that because those genres had more publishing avenues available with lower standards than "literary" fiction, there was just a LOT more slop to get through to find the good stuff (I think this continues to be the problem for people who blow those genres off).

Steampunk right now is obviously suffering from the same thing. When all you HAD were The Difference Engine and Diamond Age, it was exciting, because those books had talent and promise. Now that steampunk is big, everyone wants to publish it, and people who shouldn't be getting anything at all published are getting lots published because it fits the publisher's current plan.

In other words: I AGREE. But I have hope that it will subside; I think what will happen is that the craze will pass, eventually, and steampunk will become a subgenre of science fiction or fantasy the way that cyberpunk did. And zombies and vampires, please dear god, will go back to being just one horror option out of many. Eventually.

*edited to change an "and" to a "with," which I think captures my intention a lot better.

(More publishing avenues WITH lower standards; I do not intend to imply that sci fi publishers in general have terrible standards.)

Edited at 2010-11-03 06:21 pm (UTC)

Also, when I have a problem with sci fi and fantasy stories, it's generally because the authors have gotten too wrapped up in the trappings of the world they're creating, and forgot about a) the characters, and why I should care about them, and b) the plot. I think steampunk suffers from that x1000 because everyone is so concerned with making a STEAMPUNK story instead of making a story.

THANK you, exactly, so much. I have explained this to a few people who have gone, "huh, yeah, I see what you mean..." but yes. The idea that a set of costumes makes a story is as ridiculous as if I said "here's a medieval ball! now isn't that a great story?!"

I just can't get into a "genre" that is little more than a set of imagery.

Although, to be fair, the occasions when I have ventured into the past of science-fiction and fantasy for those original "mind blowing" stories, they seemed more like "ZOMG there's MAGIC! This must be a good story!" without much thought to character development or even a feasible plot. (I think most notably of this classic: http://www.amazon.com/Magic-Goes-Away-Collection-Return/dp/0743416937 )

So some part of me hopes that in the future of steampunk, we'll weed out the crap and the brilliant stories may return, but in the meantime I'll give most of the airships and goggles a pass.

Surely by now you would have figured out that you're in the manufacturing business; it's all about mass production.

Thank you.

I am sick to death of 98.7% of all steampunk. Things I am not sick of in the genre include Girl Genius.

I want to read something steampunk that is more, and I don't know where to look. I have been wanting to read Boneshaker for a long time now, and haven't yet gotten around to it.

I enjoy a decent amount of the fashion because I think it looks nifty, not because it's "period" or "steampunk".

What value would you have come out of this movement so it isn't wasted?

Please pardon the meandering footsteps of my words, as I'm at work and multitasking.

I like how the Foglios say Girl Genius isn't Steampunk but Gas Lamp Fantasy.

I welcomed "It's Steampunk Fortnight at Tor.Com" because it meant that I spend a lot less time reading my RSS feeds, what with all the skimming.

Really, I blame you. ;)

I had thought I had broken up with Steampunk for good, really I had. Had everything boxed up super nice and neat. Maybe even did some smack talking like one does about one's ex.

And then, Steampunk wrote me a love letter through you in that story where it was everything I loved about it and everything I believed about it and . . .when I was asked by the chair to head up the Steampunk track, I couldn't say no.

Because . . .I still believe it could be a revolution. Maybe not in the literary sense (likely not in the literary sense) but . . .in terms of the fashion, in the attitude, about how we can treat each other and what we can accomplish for charity and even maybe challenging stereotypes. I'm serious about getting work class steampunk chic going because frankly I can't afford modest steampunk clothing prices anymore in my real life. I don't *want* to be an airship pilot, I want to run faster than Jack and beat him at his own game, I want to bake in a bakery.

So, I'm saying, while That Thing we talked about has not been officially sanctioned, it v. much has not *not* been sanctioned and if you wanted, we could kick off a real grass roots aspect of it in the con world - word of mouth, posters, pamplets, steampunk working class, flower selling for charity, etc., etc.

If nothing else, I like kicking up some dirt and challenging people's notion about What This is Supposed to Be.


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